Remarks by the Vice President at a CNN Town Hall in Chester Township, Pennsylvania

MR. COOPER: Good evening. Only 13 days to go in one of the most momentous and unusual presidential races in American history.

Tonight, Kamala Harris faces voters in the biggest battleground prize: Pennsylvania. CNN Presidential Town Hall begins right now.

And welcome. We are live from Chester Township, Pennsylvania, Delaware County, one of the critical counties around Philadelphia that will help determine who wins the White House.

Welcome to CNN's Presidential Town Hall with the Democratic nominee, Vice President Kamala Harris. I'm Anderson Cooper.

Now, in this room, we have assembled a group of 32 Pennsylvania voters who say they are still undecided or persuadable. All of them are registered to vote. Some cast votes for Joe Biden in 2020, others for Donald Trump. Some didn't vote at all. And for some, this is their first election. Many are leaning right now to one candidate or another, but they all say they have yet to make their final choice.

Now we found these voters working with a nonpartisan research firm as well as business and religious groups, universities, and other civic organizations. These voters are asking their own questions tonight, selected by CNN to cover a variety of topics.

You may see them holding a piece of paper when they're asking their question. It has their question on it. That is a question they have come up with. It has not been edited in any way by CNN.

We also invited former President Donald Trump to participate in a town hall or a debate. He declined.

Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome Vice President Kamala Harris. (Applause.)

(The Vice President enters the stage.)

Madam Vice President, thank you. Appreciate it. Thanks. You have a mic right here.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you.

MR. COOPER: Thank you so much —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Good evening, everyone. Good evening.

MR. COOPER: Thank you so much for being with us. We're going to get to the audience in just a second.

I want to start by asking you, though — for weeks, you have been calling Donald Trump "unstable," "unhinged." You've called him "dangerous." You quoted General Milley recently, who called him a "fascist."

Today, you quoted General Kelly, who said that Trump repeatedly praised Hitler.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Yeah.

MR. COOPER: But there are tens of millions of Americans right now who have heard all those things, and they don't buy it or, even if they do, they're still going to vote for Donald Trump.

He's arguably more popular now than ever. You have 13 days to go. What do you say to those voters to convince them? Because some of them are in this room.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Sure, and I — I thank you all for taking the time to be here. And you could be doing a number of other things with your time, so this really is proof that we love our country. People are engaged, Anderson, and really want to talk about the issues.

And so, the issue that you raise — yes, I do believe that Donald Trump is unstable — increasingly unstable and unfit to serve.

And I don't necessarily think that everyone has heard what you and I have heard repeatedly, which is the people who know Donald Trump best, the people who worked with him in the White House, in the Situation Room, in the Oval Office — all Republicans, by the way, who served in his administration — his former chief of staff, his national security advisor, former secretaries of Defense, and his vice president have all called him unfit and dangerous.

They have said, explicitly, he has contempt for the Constitution of the United States. They have said he should never again serve as president of the United States. We know that is why Mike Pence is not running with him again, why the job was empty.

And then, today, we learned that John Kelly, a four-star Marine general, who was his longest-serving chief of staff, gave an interview recently, in the last two weeks of this election, talking about how dangerous Donald Trump is.

And I think one has to think about: Why would someone who served with him, who is not political — a four-star Marine general — why is he telling the American people now? And frankly, I think of it as — as he's just putting out a 911 call to the American people.

Understand what could happen if Donald Trump were back in the White House. And this time, we must take very seriously those folks who knew him best and who were career people are not going to be there to hold him back. At least, before, there were folks who — we know what he would say, but they would restrain him.

Imagine now Donald Trump in the Oval Office, in the Situation Room — he who has openly admired dictators, said he would be a dictator on day one. The former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff has said he is a "fascist to the core."

So, I think that when the American people reflect, especially those who are undecided, on who you should listen to, don't take my word for it. In fact, go online and listen to John Kelly — his voice — talking about what he thinks of Donald Trump two weeks before the election.

Because I think we all know — to your point, Anderson — it is close, but there are undecided voters who clearly, by being here, have an open mind, want to talk in a way that is abou- — grounded in issues and fact.

And when they hear these facts, I think it compels a lot of people to be concerned about the future of our country with Donald Trump at the lead.

You've quoted General Milley calling Donald Trump a "fascist." You yourself have not used that word to describe him.

Let me ask you tonight: Do you think Donald Trump is a fascist?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Yes, I do. Yes, I do.

And I — and I also believe that the people who know him best on this subject should be trusted. Again, look at their careers. These are not people — with the exception, I think, of only Mike Pence, these were not politicians.

These are career people who have served in — in the highest roles in national security, who have served as generals in our military, who are highly respected, talking about the person who would be commander in chief, not to mention what we know and what they've told us about he talks — how he talks about the military, servicemen and women, referring to them as "suckers" and "losers." How he — he demeans people who have taken an oath to sacrifice their life for our country.

And I do believe, Anderson, that part of this is why, even just this week, I traveled this state and others with Liz Cheney, former congressmember who was very a high-ranking Republican. She has endorsed me. Her father, the former vice president of the United States, Dick Cheney, is voting for me. Over 400 members of — previous members of the administration — from Ronald Reagan to both Presidents Bush to Donald Trump — even have endorsed my candidacy.

And the reason why, among them, is a legitimate fear, based on Donald Trump's words and actions, that he will not obey an oath to support and defend the Constitution of the United States. He himself has said he would terminate the Constitution of the United States and wants to earn your vote to stand again behind the seal of the president of the United States.

No one standing behind the seal of the president of the United States of America should be in that position saying they want to terminate the Constitution of the United States.

MR. COOPER: Let's get to some of our voters.

This is a — I want you to meet a registered Republican who's very concerned about Trump's views on democracy and January 6th. She told us she's looking for a reason to vote for you, but is yet to make her final decision.

Her name is Natasha Kwiatkowski. She's a student at Bryn Mawr College.

What's your question, Natasha?

Q: Awesome. Thank you for being here and thank you for taking my question.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you, Natasha.

Q: And as someone who hasn't fully committed to either party, how do you plan to address the concerns of independent voters and anti-Trump Republicans like myself who feel left out of the polarized political landscape? And what specific actions would you take to bridge the political divide and create more unity?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: That's a wonderful question. I pledge to you to be a president for all Americans. And I think, to the point and the spirit of your question, that people are frankly exhausted with what has been happening over the last several years, which is this environment that is suggesting that Americans should be pointing fingers at one another, that we are divided as a nation, instead of what I think you and I — I will speak for us, I think — who believe and know the vast majority of us have so much more in common than what separates us.

And I think that the American people deserve to have a president who is grounded in what is common sense, what is practical, and what is in the best interest of the people, not themselves.

I started my career as a prosecutor. And I will tell you, I never in my career — and most of my career was outside of Washington, D.C., by the way. Only four years, when I was in the Senate, were in Washington, other than being vice president.

I have never, in my career as a prosecutor, asked a victim or a witness of a crime, "Are you a Democrat or Republican?" The only thing I have ever asked is "Are you okay?"

And I do believe that is what the American people deserve in their president and not someone who makes decisions based on who voted for them or what is in their personal interest.

And I reference that because, as we know, it has been revealed that Donald Trump, when he was president, during extreme disasters, when it came time to determine how those areas — those people who had been traumatized by extreme weather would get relief, he asked the question: Did they vote for him?

I believe the American people deserve better, and they deserve a president who is focused on solutions, not sitting in the Oval Office plotting their revenge and retribution.

MR. COOPER: Let me introduce you to Erik Svendsen. He runs a service desk for an IT company in Conshohocken, Pennsylvania. He's registered as a libertarian, describes himself as an independent. He says he's undecided.

Erik.

Q: Thank you, Anderson. Thank you both for being here.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you, Erik.

Q: So, my question is concerning groceries.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Yeah.

Q: Grocery prices have gone up quite a bit in the last four years, and some people blame former President Trump. Some people blame President Biden. Who would you say is correct? And what would you do to bring prices down for Americans?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you, Erik. And you're absolutely right. You know it. I know it. I think most Americans know it. The price of groceries is still too high, and we need to address it in a number of ways.

One of my aspects of doing what we need to do to bring down the cost of living for working people and the middle class in America is to address the issue of grocery prices.

Part of my background and how I come to it is probably a new approach, grounded in a lot of my experiences as a former attorney general, where I took on price gouging. And part of my plan is to create a new approach that is the first time that we will have a national ban on price gouging, which is companies taking advantage of the desperation and need of the American consumer and jacking up prices without any consequence or accountability.

So, that is one way. But to your point, Erik, there — you know, there are a number of issues that we need to address in terms of bringing down the cost of living. It includes what we need as a — really, a new approach that I bring to the — the issue of affordable housing, including, for example, rent.

And again, I bring to it my experience, knowing what has been happening in terms of how corporations have been buying up blocks of property to diminish competition, and then rents get jacked up, and addressing that both in terms of making sure that there is a consequence and accountability for that but also investing in people's dreams of homeownership, you know, knowing that for too long, frankly, both administrations — I mean both administrations and both parties, Democrats and Republicans — haven't done enough to deal with the issue of housing.

And we need a new approach that includes working with the private sector — I say that as a — as a devout public servant — working with the private sector to cut through the red tape, working with homebuilders, working with developers to create tax incentives so that we can create more housing supply and bring down the price.

MR. COOPER: Let me just ask you about price gouging. I looked at your plan. You talked about going after price gougers — and I'm quoting from the plan — "on essential goods during emergencies or times of crisis."

I get that. How does that help, though, someone like Erik with prices that, for years, the groceries prices have just been high?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well, first of all, Anderson, as you know — and obviously CNN has been covering extensively what has been happening in the state of Georgia, North Carolina, Florida — it's a real issue.

I — I was attorney general of California. I was the top law enforcement officer of the biggest state in the country. I took this issue on because it affects a lot of people. And I'm not going to apologize for the fact that we need to actually deal with accountability when these — not all — in fact, most don't — but when companies are taking advantage of the desperation and the need of the American people.

We saw it actually during the pandemic as well, where, because of supply chain issues, we — there was a reduction of supply and then they would inflate the price of everyday necessities — not to mention, by the way, again, Donald Trump should be here tonight to talk with you and answer your questions. He's not. He refused to come.

But understand that part of his plan is to put in place a national sales tax of at least 20 percent on everyday goods and necessities. And that, by economists' estimates — independent economists — would cost you, as the American consumer and taxpayer, an additional $4,000 a year.

MR. COOPER: I want you to meet Carol Nackenoff, a political science professor at Swarthmore College. She's a registered Democrat who says she's leaning toward voting for you, has yet to make her final decision.

Carol.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Hi, Carol. Thank you.

Q: Good evening.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Good evening.

Q: Thank you for visiting us in Delaware County —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Of course.

Q: — Vice President Harris.

My question is this. If you could accomplish only one major policy goal that required congressional action, what would it be and why?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well, there's not just one. I have to be honest with you, Carol. There's a lot of work that needs to happen.

But let's — let's — I think that maybe part of this point that I — how I think about it is we've got to get past this era of politics and partisan politics slowing down what we need to do in terms of progress in our country. And that means working across the aisle.

I've done that before. We did it around — whether it be what we were able to accomplish with the bipartisan infrastructure deal or some of the work that we have done in terms of dealing with gun safety.

But we've got to work across the aisle, and it is my commitment to work with Democrats, with Republicans, with independents to deal with a number of issues, whether it be what we need to do in terms of housing and creating legislation that creates incentives for that; what we need to do to reinstate the freedom of a woman to make decisions about her own body and not have her government tell her what to do; whether it be what we need to do to actually invest in a substantial way in the industries of the future, in American-based manufacturing, in American-based industries where American workers and union workers have those jobs in a way that is good-paying jobs that gives people the dignity they deserve.

All of those areas, I plan on working across the aisle and with Congress, including the issue of immigration, which we've got to fix.

MR. COOPER: Let me ask you. You've talked about codifying Roe v. Wade. That would obviously require 60 votes in — in the Senate, a majority of the House. That's a big — that's a big leap. You don't — we don't have that yet. If that's not possible, to codify it in the House, what do you do?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I think we need to take a look at the filibuster, to be honest with you.

But the — the reality of it is this. Let's talk about how we got here. When Donald Trump was president, he hand-selected three members of the United States Supreme Court with the intention that they would undo the protections of Roe v. Wade, and they did as he intended. And now, in 20 states, we have Trump abortion bans that include punishing health care providers, doctors, and nurses.

In Texas, you know, they provide for prison for life for a health care provider for doing the job that they believe is in the best interest of their patient.

J- — laws — Trump abortion bans, some that make no exception even for rape or incest.

One of the areas I special in as a pro- — specialized in as a prosecutor was crimes against women and children. The idea you would tell a survivor of a violation to their body that they have no right to make a decision about what happens to their body next? This is what's happening in our country.

You all may have heard the stories. Women have died. Women have died because of these laws.

And the suffering — I have to say, Anderson, traveling — for example, again, I was with Liz Cheney this week. She is unapologetically pro-life and will also tell you that she doesn't agree with what's been happening.

I find that many people I've met who are pro-life have said to me, "You know, I didn't intend that this would happen. I would — I didn't intend that women who are suffering a miscarriage would develop sepsis," as has happened many times. "I didn't intend that women would die. I didn't intend that there would now be restrictions on access to in vitro fertilization. I didn't intend that there would be an effort to limit access to contraception."

So, you know, this is probably one of the most fundamental freedoms that we as Americans could imagine, which is the freedom to literally make decisions about your own body.

And on some issues, I think we've got to agree that partisanship should be put aside. And I'll close with this point: I know it is possible because when you look at the midterms, in so-called red states and so-called blue states, when this issue of freedom was on the ballot, the American people voted for freedom.

MR. COOPER: This is Leanne Griffiths. She's registered with no party affiliation. She's a student at the University of Pennsylvania. She says she's leaning towards supporting you, has yet to make up a final decision because she isn't sure who's better for the economy.

Leanne.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Yeah.

Q: Hi, Vice President. Thank you for being here today.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Of course.

Q: Considering you have been in the position of vice president for the past four years under the Biden administration, how can we expect you to deviate from the direction of that administration compared to your own? How can we differentiate your policy and your beliefs from that of Biden's?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: That's a great question. And thank you.

Well, first of all, my administration will not be a continuation of the Biden administration. I bring to this role my own ideas and my own experience. I represent a new generation of leadership on a number of issues and believe that we have to actually take new approaches.

For example, what we talked about in terms of housing, I — my experience that leads to that priority includes what I did to take on the big banks around the foreclosure crisis when I brought billions of dollars to homeowners that were the subject of predatory lending.

I know what homeownership means to the American people, not to mention what it meant to my mother, who worked very hard and saved up so that by the time I was a teenager, she was able to buy our first home.

I bring to it my experience actually taking care of my mother when she was sick, and it was — as it turned out, dying from cancer. And so, I know what it means and have the experience of taking care of an elderly relative, and I have raised children.

And so, I bring, too, my priorities and will, as president, a new approach and a new idea, frankly, about what we need to do to deal with the sandwich generation, which is what we call those folks who are literally in the middle, who are raising their young children and taking care of their parents, which is why my plan and approach says, "Hey, you shouldn't have to — to wipe out all your savings to qualify for Medicaid to be able to get support, to hire somebody to help you cook for your parent or help them put on a sweater." I've done that. I know what that requires.

You shouldn't have to quit your job in order to do the work that is necessary to take care of your children and your parent, because it's overwhelming to try to do it all. And so, my plan is to have and allow Medicare to cover the cost of home health care for our seniors.

These are a couple of examples, including what we talked about in terms of price gouging and what we need to do in addition — and it's a new approach that I think is well overdue — let's invest in the small businesses of America.

I — I — the woman who helped raise us was a small-business owner. I know who small-business owners are. I know what they do. They are the backbone of America's economy, and for too long, we've overlooked their value to the economy as a whole, much less to the economy of neighborhoods and communities.

So, that's why my plan — and it's a new approach — is about tax cuts for our small businesses so that they can invest in themselves and grow and, in the process, invest in communities, invest in neighborhoods, and strengthen our economy overall.

So, those are some examples. It's about a new approach, a new generation of leadership based on new ideas and, frankly, different experiences.

I bring a whole set of different experiences to this job and the way I think about it —

MR. COOPER: Some — some —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: — than — than Joe Biden.

MR. COOPER: Some voters, though, might ask: You've been in the White House for — for four years. You were vice president, not the president, but why wasn't any of that done over the last four years?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well, there was a lot that was done, but there's more to do, Anderson. And — and I am pointing out things that need to be done that haven't been done but need to be done. And I'm not going to shy away from saying, "Hey, these are still problems that we need to fix."

MR. COOPER: I want you to meet Jaxon Weiss. He's a student at Drexel University from Flourtown, Pennsylvania; registered Republican, says he's leaning toward voting for you, but has yet to make up a final decision.

Jaxon.

Q: Thank you, Anderson.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Hi, Jaxon.

Q: Thank you for taking the time to be here, too, Vice President Harris.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: You too. Thank you.

Q: Regarding the rapid increase in the migrant population, how will you ensure that every immigrant is integrated into American society safely? What benefits and subsidies will you provide them with? And how long will these benefits and subsidies last for an individual? Most importantly, will the American citizens' taxes pay for these benefits and subsidies? And if so, how much mon- — how much money will be allocated?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well, thank you, Jaxon. Let's start with this. America's immigration system is broken, and it needs to be fixed, and it's been broken for a long time. And part of what we need to do is always prioritize what we need to do to strengthen our border.

I will tell you, I'm the only person in this race, among the two choices that voters have — I have personally prosecuted transnational criminal organizations in the trafficking of guns, drugs, and human beings. I have spent a significant part of my career making sure that our border is secure and that we do not allow criminals in and we don't allow that kind of trafficking to happen and come into our country.

And as the — as my opponent has proven himself, he would prefer to run on the problem instead of fix the problem. You may know, there were some of the most conservative members of the United States Congress, working with others, that came up with a border security bill that would have put 1,500 more border agents at the border. Those boarder agents are overwhelmed. They need the support. They need the backup.

It would have allowed us to have more resources to stem the flow of fentanyl. I don't need to tell this state and people around the country what is happening in terms of the scourge of fentanyl and how it is literally killing Americans.

It would have put resources into stemming the flow. It would have given more resources to prosecute — to investigate and prosecute transnational criminal organizations. It would have done a lot of good.

Donald Trump got wind of the bill and told them, "Don't put it forward." He killed the bill because he'd prefer to run on a problem instead of fixing a problem.

We have to have a secure border, and we have to have a comprehensive pathway for citizenship.

MR. COOPER: Le- — let me —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: And that includes requiring people — hardworking people to earn citizenship and do it in a comprehensive, humane, and orderly manner.

MR. COOPER: Let me ask you about that. I mean, you talk about the bill that Donald Trump quashed. That was in 2024. You talk about the bill he tried to get passed in 2021. That wasn't able to get passed. 2022, 2023 —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Sure.

MR. COOPER: — there were record border crossings. You — your administration took a number — hundreds of executive actions. It didn't stem the flow. Numbers kept going up.

Finally, in 2024, just in June, three weeks before the la- — the first presidential debate with Joe Biden, you institute executive actions that had a dramatic impact, really shut down people crossing over. Why didn't your administration do that in 2022, 2023?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: First of all, you're exactly right, Anderson. And as of today, we have cut the flow of immigration by over half. In fact, the numbers I saw most recently, illegal immigration is low- —

MR. COOPER: But if it was that easy —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: But hold on. Let me finish. Let me —

MR. COOPER: — with that executive action, why not do it in —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well —

MR. COOPER: — 2022, 2023?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: — because we were working with Congress and hoping that, actually, we could have a long-term fix to the problem instead of a short-term fix.

MR. COOPER: You couldn't have done one and the — both at the same time?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well, here's the thing. We have to understand that ultimately this problem is going to be fixed through congressional action. Congress has the authority and the purse — I — I hate to use D.C. terms, but, literally, they write the checks.

Part of the issue is in order to really fix the problem at the border — I was just at the border recently talking with border agents. You know what they talk about? Yes, they are overwhelmed. They're working around the clock. And the other thing that they talk to me about: We need more judges down there to deal with asylum claims. We need more personnel down there to deal with processing.

A- — but, Anderson — and that's where Congress kicks in, in terms of dedicating the resources to actually fixing the problem.

We have dealt with it such that, to your point, we now, as of today, as of our — our visit, have lower undocumented immigrants and illegal immigration than Trump when he left office.

MR. COOPER: That — that's true —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: But we need a permanent solution, and that requires —

MR. COOPER: Do you wish you had done that —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: — bipartisan work.

MR. COOPER: Do you wish you had done those executive orders in 2022, 2023?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I think we did the right thing, and — but the best thing that can happen for the American people is that we have bipartisan work happening. And I pledge to you that I will work across the aisle to fix this long-standing problem.

I think the American people are demanding it —

MR. COOPER: Yeah.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: — on both sides of the aisle, and it's time we actually put the partisan approach to this aside. We know what can work.

MR. COOPER: Well, let's talk about this compromise bill you — that you want to pass if you are elected. You said that's going to be a priority. It includes $650 million in funding for the border wall. That's something Republicans wanted. That was part of the compromise.

Under Donald Trump, you criticized the wall more than 50 times. You called it "stupid," "useless," and a "medieval vanity project." Is a border wall stupid?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well, let's talk about Donald Trump and that border wall. (Laughs.) So, remember Donald Trump said Mexico would pay for it? Come on. They didn't. How much of that wall did he build? I think the last number I saw was about 2 percent. And then, when it came time for him to do a photo op, you know where he did it? In the part of the wall that President Obama built.

MR. COOPER: But you're agreeing —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: So, come on. (Laughs.)

MR. COOPER: — to a bill that would earmark $650 million to continue building that wall.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: We — I — I pledge that I'm going to bring forward that bipartisan bill to further strengthen and secure our border. Yes, I am.

MR. COOPER: But —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: And I'm going to work across the aisle to pass com- — a comprehensive bill that deals with a broken immigration system.

I think Jaxon's question, part of it, was to acknowledge that America has always had migration, but there needs to be a legal process for it. People have to earn it.

MR. COOPER: Right.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: And that's the point that, I think, is the most important point that can be made, which is we need a president who is grounded in common sense and practical outcomes. Like, let's just fix this thing. Let's just fix it. Why is there any ideological perspective on — let's just fix the problem.

MR. COOPER: To fix the problem, you're — you're doing this compromise bill. It does call for $650 million that was earmarked under Trump to actually still go to build the wall.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I am not afraid of good ideas where the occur, Anderson.

MR. COOPER: You do- — so, you don't think it's "stupid" anymore?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I think what he did and how he did it did — was — did not make much sense, because he actually didn't do much of anything. I just t- — talked about that wall, right? (Laughs.) We just talked about it. He didn't actually do much of anything.

MR. COOPER: But you do want to build some wall?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I want to strengthen our border.

MR. COOPER: This is Annalise Kean. She's from Philadelphia. She works as a fundraiser for Habitat for Humanity. She's registered with no party affiliation. She says she's a Democrat. She's leaning toward voting for you but said she's yet to make her final decision, in part because of the conflict in the Middle East.

Annalise.

Q: Thank you. And good evening, Madam Vice President.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Good evening.

Q: My question is, as president, what would you do to ensure not another Palestinian dies due to bombs being funded by U.S. tax dollars?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: So, I will say — and I think this is to your point — far too many innocent Palestinian civilians have been killed. It's unconscionable. And we are now at a place where, with Sinwar's death, I do believe we have an opportunity to end this war, bring the hostages home, bring relief to the Palestinian people, and work toward a two-state solution where Israel and the Palestinians in equal measure have security, where the Palestinian people have dignity, self-determination, and the safety they — that they so rightly deserve.

MR. COOPER: What — what do you say to voters who are thinking about supporting a third-party candidate or staying on the couch, not voting at all because of this issue?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Listen, I am not going to deny the strong feelings that people have. I don't know that anyone who has seen the images who would not have strong feelings about what has happened, much less those who have relatives who have died and been killed. And I — and I know people and have talked with people, so I appreciate that.

But I also do know that, for many people who care about this issue, they also care about bringing down the price of groceries. They also care about our democracy and not having a president of the United States who admires dictators and is a fascist.

They also care about the fact that we need practical, commonsense solutions from a leader who is willing to work across the aisle on behalf of the American people and not themselves.

P- — they want a president who cares about a fundamental freedom to make decisions about your own body, understanding that we're not trying to change anyone's belief, but let's not have the government telling women what to do with their body.

MR. COOPER: I want you to meet Beth Samberg. She's a realtor, a mom of four from Bala Cynwyd, Pennsylvania. She's a registered Democrat. Says she's undecided because of concerns about antisemitism.

Beth.

Q: Hi. Thank you for being here.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you, Beth.

Q: Thank you for remembering we need to bring the hostages home.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Of course.

Q: The rise of antisemitism and violence from — the rise of antisemitism and violence from antisemitism has risen greatly on college campuses and on our city streets in the last year. How would you combat this growing trend and protect our young adults?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you, Beth. You are right, and I will say that we have seen a rise in antisemitism. It is something that we have to be honest about and we have to deal with.

As attorney general, I actually published a hate crimes report on a regular basis, and antisemitism was among the highest forms of hate in our country. And this was before October 7, and we know what we've seen since.

Part of what we've got to do is talk with people so that they understand what are the tropes, what are the — the roots of — of what we are seeing so that we can actually have people be more understanding.

We need to have laws in place that make those who would commit crimes on behalf of antisemitism and hate — that they pay a serious consequence.

We need to have the deterrent so that doesn't happen. We need to ensure that college students are safe in their school and feel safe to be able to go to class.

But I'm going to tell you what doesn't help. Again, I invite you to listen and — go online to listen to John Kelly, the former chief of staff of Donald Trump, who has told us Donald Trump said, "Why" — essentially, "Why aren't my generals like those of Hitler's?" Like Hitler. Who has referred several times — we've heard the reports for years.

MR. COOPER: Do you believe Donald Trump is antisemitic?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I believe Donald Trump is a danger to the well-being and security of America.

MR. COOPER: He has said that he — he's casting himself as a protector of Israel. Do you believe you would be more pro-Israel than Donald Trump?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I believe that Donald Trump is dangerous. I believe that when you have a president of the United States who has said to his generals who work for him, because he is commander in chief — these conversations, I assume, many of them took place in the Oval Office — and if the president of the United States, the commander in chief, is saying to his generals, in essence, "Why can't you be more like Hitler's generals" — Anderson, come on. This is a serious, serious issue.

And we know who he is. He admires dictators, sending love letters back and forth with Kim Jong Un; talks about the president of Russia. And then, most recently, the reports are that in the height of COVID, when most Americans could not get their hands on a COVID test — Americans were dying by the hundreds a day — he secretly sent COVID tests to the president of Russia for his personal use.

So, again, there — thi- — this election in 13 days is presenting the American people with a very significant decision. And on the one side, on this issue of who is going to model what it means to use the bully pulpit of the president of the United States in a manner that in tone, word, and deed is about lifting up our discourse, fighting against hate, as opposed to fanning the flames of hate, which Donald Trump does consistently — I — I'm going to tell you, we are an incredible country, and we love our country. You all wouldn't be here unless we love our country. And there are certain things where we've just got to come together and realize that — that we do believe in the importance of healthy debate on real issues, but there are certain standards we've got to have.

And, you know, another point that even John Kelly talked about, I — I believe, and many have, is January 6th, where you have the president of the United States defying the will of the people in a free and fair election and unleashing a violent mob who attacked the United States Capitol. A hundred and forty law enforcement officers were attacked; some were killed.

And so, I say that to say: The American people deserve to have a president who encourages healthy debate; works across the aisle; not afraid of good ideas, wherever they come from; but also maintains certain standards about how we think about the role and the responsibility; and certainly not comparing oneself, in a clearly admiring way, to Hitler.

MR. COOPER: We're going to take a — a quick break. We'll have more from the CNN Presidential Town Hall with Vice President Kamala Harris.

(Commercial break.)

And we are back with Vice President Kamala Harris.

I want to ask you about something I read. I read that the fir- — one of the first phone calls you made after President Biden announced that he was dropping out was to your pastor.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Yes.

MR. COOPER: And I'm wondering, if it wasn't a confessional, if you could say what that conversation was like.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well, my pastor, Reverend Dr. Amos C. Brown of Third Baptist Church —

It was — it was an extraordinary day, that Sunday, when the president called me. And I — I instinctively understood the gravity of the moment, the seriousness of the moment. I didn't predict or know exactly how that day would play out. And obviously, now it's been three months since I've been at the top of the ticket — actually, three months as of yesterday.

But I just called him. I — I needed that spiritual kind of connection. I needed that advice. I needed a prayer. And — and there's a — there's a part of the scripture that talks about Esther and "a time such as this." And — and that's what we talked about, and it was very comforting for me. And — and —

MR. COOPER: Do you pray every day?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I do pray every day. I do pray every day, sometimes twice a day.

I — you know, my — I grew up — so, we grew up — a little neighborhood church in Oakland, 23rd Avenue Church of God. And I was raised to believe in a loving God, to believe that your faith is a verb, you know? You — you live your faith, and — and that — that the way that one should do that is that your work and your life's work should be to think about how you can serve in a way that is uplifting other people, that is about caring for other people. And that guides a lot of how I think about my work and — and what is important.

MR. COOPER: Let's go to the voters. I want you to meet Joe Donahue from Bucks County, Pennsylvania.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Hi, Joe.

MR. COOPER: He works in customer service for a local retailer. He serves as a local election official. He's a registered Republican who says he's undecided, doesn't agree with your stance on abortion, but he is concerned about what he calls Trump's demeanor and actions on January 6th.

Joe.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Hi, Joe.

Q: Thank you, Madam Vice President. And thank you, Anderson.

Madam Vice President, everybody — as human beings, we are not perfect. We have our flaws. We make mistakes. We have our weaknesses. And the office of the presidency can sometimes bring those weaknesses out in ways that the incumbent may not expect.

What weaknesses do you bring to the table, and how do you plan to overcome them while you're in office?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: That's a great question, Joe. Well, I am certainly not perfect — (laughs) — so let's start there.

And I think that — I — perhaps a weakness, some would say, but I actually think it's a strength, is I really do value having a team of very smart people around me who bring to my de- — decision-making process different perspectives. I — my team will tell you, I am constantly saying, "Let's hi- — kick the tire on that. Let's kick the tires on it."

Because, I — listen, I — as I mentioned earlier, I started my career as a prosecutor. I was a courtroom prosecutor. I've tried everything from low-level offenses to homicides, and I learned at a very early stage of my career and adult life that my actions have a direct impact on real people in a very fundamental way.

When I was attorney general of California, I was attorney general of the — what is the fifth largest economy in the world and acutely aware that my words could move markets.

So, I take my role and responsibility as an elected leader very seriously, and I know the impact it has on so many people I may never meet. And that is why I engage and bring folks around.

So, I may not be quick to have the answer as soon as you ask it about a specific policy issue sometimes, because I'm going to want to research it. I'm going to want to study it. I'm kind of a nerd sometimes — (laughs) — I confess. And some might call that a weakness, especially if you're, you know, in an interview or just kind of, you know —

MR. COOPER: L- — let me a- —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: — being asked a certain question, and you're expected to have the right answer right away. But that's how I — that's how I work.

MR. COOPER: I- — you — we — I don't think I've ever heard the former president admit a mistake. A lot of politicians don't. Is there something you can point to in your life, political life or in your life in the last four years, that you think is a mistake that you have learned from?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I mean, I — I've made many mistakes, and they range from — you know, if you've ever parented a child, you know you make lots of mistakes too. (Laughs.)

In my role as vice president, I mean, I've probably worked very hard at making sure that I am well-versed on issues, and I think that is very important. It's a mistake not to be well-versed on an issue and feel compelled to answer a question.

MR. COOPER. I want you to meet Pam Thistle. She's from Wyndmoor, Pennsylvania. She's a realtor. She's a widow. Her husband, Mike, died just a year ago.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Oh, I'm sorry.

MR. COOPER: She has two daughters in college. She registered with no party affiliation and says she's undecided. She has concerns about how you would handle the economy.

Pam.

Q: Thank you. And thank you, Anderson. And happy belated birthday too.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you. Thank you very much.

Q: I really —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: And I'm sorry for your loss. I'm sorry.

Q: Oh, thank you. Yes. And I'm really appreciative for you to be here and get to know you.

When you talk about rich people paying their fair share, can you be more specific? Income taxes are already on a graduated scale, where the more you make, the higher percentage you pay in taxes. So, the rich are paying a disproportionate amount in taxes as it is. Over 40 percent of Americans don't pay any income taxes. Also, the really high earners may move their money offshore if there are disinte- — disincentives in the U.S. This could impact the economy.

I would like to hear more nuts and bolts about your economic plans.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Sure. Thank you, Pam.

So, first of all, it is the case in the United States of America that billionaires, on average, pay less taxes as a percentage —

Q: Yeah.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: — than teachers and firefighters and nurses.

Q: Yeah.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: And that —

Q: I'm talking about hard workers like — like pound the street, have some success.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I'm — yes. No, no, no, I understand.

Q: Yes.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: But I want to just — let's set the — let —

Q: Not the really high.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Let's set the scene, right?

Q: Yeah.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: So, when I say that the — the richest among us need to pay their fair share —

Q: Okay.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: — I am referencing that, and I — I need to reference that because, sadly, Donald Trump, when he was president, gave tax cuts to the richest, to billionaires and big corporations, which added trillions of dollars to our deficit. So, that, sadly, needs to be said in a way that should be obvious, to your point, but is not, given what he did.

Now, in terms of what we need to do to bring down taxes, I have pledged and have a plan for a middle-class tax cut that would affect 100 million Americans, including, for example, what we will do around small businesses in terms of tax deductions, in terms of what small businesses are now being mired in, in terms of a bureaucracy around they have to fill out and do their taxes in a way that actually holds them back.

Part of my plan includes extending a middle-class tax cut that would include a $6,000 tax cut, essentially a child tax credit, for parents — and young parents, in particular — knowing that the vast majority of our parents have a natural desire to parent their children well but not always the resources. So, this is going to include an extra amount of, just, money that people can use to pay for childcare, which is far too expensive for too many working pa- — families.

And part of the issue here is this. We cannot, and I will not, raise taxes on anyone making less than $400,000 a year.

MR. COOPER: Yeah.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: But we do need to take seriously the system that benefits the richest and does not help out working, middle-class Americans.

I come from the middle class, and I believe that the middle class needs tax breaks to be able to actually not just get by but get ahead.

MR. COOPER: So, you're saying — what — what you're saying is anyone under $400,000 won't have taxes raised. Are you saying that anyone above $400,000 will have a tax raise?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I'm saying that there is going to be a parity around what the richest people pay in terms of their taxes. Right now, Anderson, you know the document — the — it is well-documented that some of the richest people in our country have gotten away with a zero-tax rate.

MR. COOPER: But if you earning $500-, $600-, $700,000, under your plan, there's a good chance your taxes will go up?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I- — this — we can't have this conversation without knowing what thi- — it's a very complicated situation, right? If you're talking about a small-business owner, I'm going to bring down — cut taxes for small businesses — right? — because I know that they need the overhead — the money that they need for overhead to actually benefit the growth of their business, which benefits our economy as a whole.

MR. COOPER: Let's go to — actually, you know, I want to reference something that — that — about Pam. Pam, w- — mentioned her husband, Steve, died a year ago. You — you've talked about your mom, Shyamala Harris, who died 15 years ago. What has grief been like for you? Do you still grieve?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Yeah, you don't stop grieving. You don't stop grieving.

I mean, the — I — I think that there is — you know, there are, like, two sides to a coin when you have lost somebody you love. And — or that two sides to a coin, that phrase becomes evident, which is, if you have had the blessing of a close and — and important relationship with someone, then when you ha- — that the other side of the coin is that when you lose them, the grief becomes even deeper.

But I also believe that, for example, anyone who has lost a family member through cancer or an illness — my mother died from cancer. It is important to try and remember them as they lived and not as they died, because the grief can really weigh you down.

I think the brain has a way of, when you're grieving, really spiraling down, and it's important, I think, to try and remember those you have lost in a way they'd want to be remembered, as being vibrant.

And — and I think it's important to just — to — to grieve as one does. I don't think there's any correct or proper way to grieve. And the most important thing is, I think, that people do not suppress what they're feeling at any moment, and the rest of us should give them grace to — to go through it as — as they will.

MR. COOPER: We're going to take a — a short break. We'll be right back with more from the CNN Presidential Town Hall with Vice President Kamala Harris.

(Commercial break.)

And we are back with Vice President Kamala Harris. I want you to meet Rob MacPherson. He's the chief marketing officer for a local organization. He's registered Republican, from Media, Pennsylvania, who told us he's leaning towards voting for you but has concerns about what he calls "shifts" in your policy positions.

Rob.

Q: Thank you. Thank you for being here, Vice President Harris. So, welcome to Delco.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you. (Laughter.) Thank you.

Q: Here in Delco, we — we pride ourselves on being authentic —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Yeah.

Q: — and much of what we have se- — been say- — have seen much of what you've been saying with regard to issues like law and order and fracking reflect a more centrist view than what people are used to hearing from Kamala Harris, leaving some voters to wonder about the authenticity of your current more moderate positions. Can you talk a little bit about how your positions have shifted and why?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Sure. And thank you.

So, first of all, on fracking. I've been very clear. We kind of dispensed with this in 2020. I am not going to ban fracking. I did not as vice president. In fact, as vice president, I cast the tiebreaking vote that now has opened up more fracking leases.

My value on the issue of what we need to do to invest in a clean energy economy and a clean energy future has not changed. But frankly, I now have the experience and perspective of having been vice president for almost four years. I've traveled the country. I know that we can invest in a clean energy economy and still not ban fracking and still work toward what we need to do to create more jobs and create U.S.-based jobs in a way that will be globally competitive.

On the issue of law and order, as you mentioned, I think there's just a whole lot of misinformation, to be honest with you. I have personally prosecuted very serious crime. It's how I started my career. I spent most of my career as a prosecutor, not in Washington, D.C.

And as my first priority had — and — and remains as a first priority to me — the safety of the American people. So, that has not changed. And sadly, I think that there is a bit of misinformation, if not more than a bit, but I'm glad that you raised the subject so that I can address it.

MR. COOPER: You — but — but —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: But I — but — but — just if you don't mind —

MR. COOPER: Sure.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: — just let me just finish — I — because I think the — the spirit of your question is really important, and I'm glad you raised it.

Our country deserves to have a president of the United States who is not afraid of good ideas and does not stand on pride if a perspective needs to be informed by different points of view to build consensus and to have a commonsense approach.

I'm never going to shy away from good ideas, and I'm not going to feel the need to have pride associated with a position that I've taken when the important thing is to build consensus to fix problems. I believe in fixing problems. I love fixing problems.

And so, I pledge to you to be a president who not only works for all Americans but works on getting stuff done. And that means compromise. And it doesn't mean compromising your values or your principles, but it does mean working to get stuff done.

MR. COOPER: But —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: And I pledge to you I will do that.

MR. COOPER: Just to be clear, though, what he's referring to — and you point out, too, when you were running for vice president in 2020, you were not talking about banning fracking. But —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: No, no. No, Anderson, I — I pledged that I would not ban fracking.

MR. COOPER: Right, I know. You said —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Yeah.

MR. COOPER: — you would not ban fracking.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Correct.

MR. COOPER: You know, you had said in a 2019 town hall, "There's no question, I'm in favor of banning fracking." In 2017, you talked about Medicare for All. You talked about — in 2019, you raised a hand in a debate about if bor- — border crossings should be decriminalized.

Are all of those issues — which those are not your positions now — are all those issues that you're saying, through consensus and getting stuff done, you have evolved on?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well, no, let's take, for example, the issue of Medicare. My point has always been that access to health care should not just be a privilege of those who can afford it. It should be a right for all people.

So, that is why I have worked on doing what we have done to, one, allow Medicare to negotiate against the big pharmaceutical companies to bring down the cost of prescription medication. We've a- — we've achieved that in terms of capping the cost of insulin for seniors at $35 a month, capping the cost of — of annual prescriptions at $2,000 a year for seniors.

But my plan moving forward, based on that very principle that I've always had, is, as president, to have that cap be for everyone and not just for our seniors.

The work that I have done that has been about recognizing the importance of dealing with border security — that has never changed. As I said, I have prosecuted transnational criminal organizations. That I did for years before I ever ran in 2019.

MR. COOPER: I mean, you did raise your hand saying in a debate when asked if border crossing should be decriminalized. But obviously, that is not your — your position.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I — I never intended, nor do I — will I ever allow America to have a border that is not secure. I believe we need to deal with illegal immigration. There needs to be consequences, which is why part of my plan that I have outlined — and again, please go to KamalaHarris.com; sorry to throw a website on you, but why not? — and you will see that part of my plan includes what we need to do to actually do more as it relates to putting resources in, including increasing penalties for illegal crossings.

MR. COOPER: And just finally, on fracking. You said you're clear: You would not ban it as president. Yo- —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: No, I would not ban it as president.

MR. COOPER: Right. You're — I know — you're clear on that. Do you think it is bad for the environment though?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: I think that we have proven that we can invest in a clean energy economy. We can mitigate greenhouse gas emissions. We can work on a — and sustaining what we need to do to protect this beautiful earth of ours and not ban fracking.

MR. COOPER: Time is short, so I want to get some more voters in.

Taneisha Spall from Lansdowne, Pennsylvania. She works as an education administration manager for the Pennsylvania Department of Corrections. Registered Democrat who says she's leaning towards supporting you. Has yet to make her final decision.

Taneisha, welcome.

Q: Thank you, Anderson. Thank you, Madam Vice President —

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you.

Q: — for joining us this evening.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Of course.

Q: I appreciate that you did acknowledge that we are a country that is faced with problems and issues. With the Supreme Court being plagued with issues, would you be in favor of expanding the court to, say, 12 so each justice has only one circuit court other than chief justice to assist in making judgments more balanced?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Well, to your point, I — there is no question that the American people increasingly are losing confidence in the Supreme Court, and in large part because of the behavior of certain members of that court and because of certain rulings, including the Dobbs decision and taking away a precedent that had been in place for 50 years, protecting a woman's right to make decisions about her own body.

So, I do believe that there should be some kind of reform of the court, and we can study what that actually looks like.

But I do believe — but, again, let's just — while you raise the point of the court, understand that, again, in 13 days, the American people will decide who is the next president of the United States. In 13 days, you will decide who is sitting in the Oval Office on January 20th.

And on one hand, you have in Donald Trump someone who has increasingly proved himself to be unstable and who — as we have established and the people close to him have established, he is unfit to serve. Somebody who, on January 20th, you can be sure will spend full time, like we know — and we've seen the image mentally of him sitting in the dining room off of the Oval Office, watching for hours as people violently attack the Capitol. You can be sure, because he has said he would weaponize the Department of Justice to go after his political enemies, that you can look at a Donald Trump in the White House after January 20th, sitting in that Oval Office, plotting his revenge.

He has talked about "the enemies within." We haven't even raised that subject, Anderson. "The enemies within" — he's talking about the American people. He's talking about journalists, judges, nonpartisan election officials.

He has talked about, as John Kelly has talked about, can he send the military after peaceful protesters. And he's going to sit there, unstable, unhinged, plotting his revenge, plotting his retribution, creating an enemies list.

I'm going to tell you: My list will be a list of how I address and continue to address the issues that you all are raising this afternoon and evening. It will be a to-do list about how we can impact the American people and lift up the American people and address some of the challenges that we continue to face.

MR. COOPER: I want to get one last questioner in. This is Elkan Pleat. He is a student at Temple University, registered Democrat, leaning towards voting for you, has yet to make up his final decision.

Elkan.

Q: Hi. First of all, go Birds. (Laughter.) And hi from — I'm from Danville, California.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Aww. Hi, Elkan.

Q: But my question is: What is the proudest moment of your political career thus far, including when you were the AG?

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Oh, that's a great one. I've actually had a few. One of them is I, as attorney general of California, created what I named the Bureau of Children's Justice, fa- — and you may be familiar with that as a Californian. And it was f- — it was because I believe that, frankly, we still have a lot to do in terms of policy that impacts children and an investment in the children of our country is an investment in all of us and our future.

And that work has actually produced significant results. That has been a proud moment for me.

It was a proud moment for me to — to do the work that we've been doing that has addressed issues like maternal mortality. I mean, it's in response to an incredible tragedy, but lifting up that issue in a way that we agree that America should not have one of the highest maternal mortality rates in the world.

So, I have had the good fortune of, in my life as a public servant, knowing the impact that we can have. And I guess that is probably what motivates me most, because I know we can make a difference. I really do.

And I do believe that the American people deserve a president who is going to be hardworking. And, you know, we'll make mistakes from time to time, but it's focused on you. And I think that is so fundamental in this election. So fundamental.

You deserve a president — I believe the American people deserve a president who is saying, "Look, let's just be practical." Let's get things done. And let's not be afraid of having a little joy — (laughs) — to the point of, you know, what gives you — what makes you feel good about your work. Let's — let's do it in a way that is grounded in optimism.

You know, the thing that I think we all know about who we are as the American people, we are people who are ambitious. We have aspirations. We have dreams. We are inherently optimistic — inherently optimistic.

And I — I think people are exhausted with the idea that we're just going to be divided and angry instead of working on the problems and working together. And that's what motivates me, and that's what makes me proud when we're able to do that. So —

MR. COOPER: Vice President Kamala Harris, thank you very much.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you.

MR. COOPER: Appreciate it.

THE VICE PRESIDENT: Thank you, Anderson. (Applause.) Thank you.

MR. COOPER: And thanks for watching. Thanks to all the voters here. Be sure to join CNN on November 5th for election night in America, right here on CNN.

Jake Tapper and Erin Burnett pick it up right now. (Applause.)